Death of 25man?

Yesterday I talked about the two most recent announcements and how it would effect your free time.  Today I want to talk about a different aspect of the game it will effect and hit mainly on the first announcement that is putting the 10 and 25 man raids on one lockout.

Should I be angry about a change to a game I don’t play?  Sure, why not.

I’m not actually angry, just sad.  I think this change is a huge detriment to the community that they try to promote.

At the moment the reason to run 25 man is because the loot is superior.  You have a lot of groups that struggle in 25 man raids because they are PUG’ing 5-15 people.  They do this struggle because they know its where the good loot lives.  If they could drop those PUGs allowing them to run a decent group for the same loot they would happily do that.

I think we’ll see a HUGE decline in the number of 25 man raids that are being run.  Raid leading is stressful, if you can ease that stress by 150% without really losing anything… then its a huge boon.

You’ll still see the uber 25 man groups I think.  There is more prestige to do it with 25 than 10 of course but there’s no reason to struggle on 25 man for less than you could do in a more competent 10 man.

You’ll see a lot of really horrible 25 man groups as well.  They’ll be recruiting in trade chat (/point Marisse) and forming groups to go do things you wouldn’t have imagined.  Except now those groups aren’t going to be mains that missed out on their 25 man for the week… they are going to be semi geared alts trying to figure out why they get aggro when they death grip the mob.

My estimation is that you’ll see 60% less 25 man raids than there are right now.  Even if the difficulty level is similar… 10 people management is soooooooooooooooooo much easier than 25 people wrangling.

Once you take into account the fact that your character is cap’d on the number of points you can earn in a week you realize you have another reason to go with a group that is better and more likely to get the job done.

Why struggle with 25 when you can rape with 10?


5 thoughts on “Death of 25man?

  1. Conifer says:

    Here is why I think this is a good change: There are a lot of us (and I believe you are included in this group) that really prefer 10man raiding. Not because it is easier, but just because you feel like you know all 10 people. They are good people. And you enjoy playing with them.

    Almost exclusively the reason I put up with 25man raiding is the loot. If you take that out of the equation, I would rather spend 3 days a week working on my 10man.

  2. Malaren says:

    I was just talking to zerio about this last night. I have always preferred 10-mans. It used to be b/c I couldn’t stand having all those people on my screen at one time (I imagine 40-man raids were a nightmare). As I got used to doing 25-mans, I always felt like I was lost in the crowd and that it didn’t really matter if I was there or not, but running 10-mans made me feel like my contribution actually mattered.

    Some people say that the larger raids feel more epic. I guess I just don’t see what’s so epic about you and 24 other people going to beat up on one person. It feels like more of an accomplishment on an individual level to say that you and your 9 friends killed the Lich King.

    Praise Jeebus that come Cataclysm, I’ll never have to step foot in a 25-man raid again just b/c it has better loot, legendaries, and mounts (I hope).

  3. MrAcelow says:

    Burning Crusade was most successful satisfying both 10 and 25 player raid content.

    Having strictly 10 man raid instances like KZ and ZA allowed groups to have that “epic” feel.

    Not sure of the new changes will be the end of 25’s, we can expect the larger social circles running.

    The lockout in my opinion will encourage more alts to choose 10s over 25s.

  4. Xeo says:

    KZ was a nice, here’s raiding and learn how to do it raid. It could be used to gear alts and help out new peeps. ZG was awesome because it offered some challenge and some nice loot on the side of 25 man raids. But if you could have gone into Black Temple with your awesome 10man group as opposed to your struggling 25man group… you would have. Especially from a raid leads perspective. There’s no reason for someone to try to juggle 25 when they can do 10 for literally the same gain. The only reason I see to running 25man post Cataclysm is nerd points and to say, “I’ve cleared such and such on 25man” which in theory will be harder… because 25 competent people isn’t as easy to find as 10.

  5. Xeo says:

    Ya know I’ve never thought about it that way… I can certainly see how you feel lost in the crowd. I can tell you from the raid leads perspective I can tell you that we literally feel the loss of each person in the raid. Which is why I always let out those, “/le sigh” when someone would die to something retarded. Well, sometimes it was because they were fucking retarded but losing 1 person for any reason is a huge deficit for the rest of the fight whether you (as a dps) realize it or not. Good DPS (read: you) makes it even more costly.

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